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a new ETF spotted .... EX20

Discussion in 'Exchange Traded Funds (ETF)' started by twisted strategies, 12th Oct, 2016.

  1. twisted strategies

    twisted strategies Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    QLD
    spotted a newly listed ETF today ... EX20 ( avoiding the ASX top 20 or XTL index )

    this falls outside my requirements ,
    i would RATHER BUY a top 20 ETF in a correction and seems to only pay half yearly ( i stopped researching after that )

    i always suggest extra research into ETF products , those tiny differences can make it a winner or a big dud for you .

    ( DYOR )

    i hold LIC CIE which plays in this niche
     
  2. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Co-founder Staff Member

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    Do they explain what their rationale behind avoiding the ASX top 20 is?

    Looking for more growth because the top 20 are "too boring"?

    I wouldn't have thought that only excluding the top 20 would make much difference - although I guess the collective market cap of those top 20 is going to be pretty heavy compared to the next 20 or even the next 50 or more.
     
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  3. twisted strategies

    twisted strategies Well-Known Member

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    official description :-

    Betashares Australian Ex-20 Portfolio Diversifier ETF (EX20) provides investors with a simple, cost-effective way to obtain exposure to a passively-managed, diversified portfolio of Australian shares, excluding the largest 20 stocks by market capitalisation. The Fund aims to track the performance of an index (before fees and expenses) which provides exposure to 180 stocks listed on the Australian Securities Exchange, ranked from number 21 to number 200, based on their market capitalisation.

    listed on 7th of October 2016 so is very immature

    Mgmt Fee** (% p.a.) 0.20%
    Distribution Frequency Semi-annual

    Top 10 Portfolio Holdings - 12-Oct-2016
    Name %
    1 Newcrest Mng Ltd 2.7 %
    2 AVEO Group 2.5 %
    3 South32 Limited 2.3 %
    4 Ins Australia Group Ltd 2.2 %
    5 AGL Energy Ltd 2.2 %
    6 Orica Ltd. 2.1 %
    7 ALS Limited 2.0 %
    8 Sonic Healthcare 1.8 %
    9 Ramsay Health Care 1.8 %
    10 Oil Search Ltd 1.8 %

    i already hold
    AOG ( 'free-carried ')
    S32 ( as a bonus divestment from BHP )
    and ALQ ( in heavy loss )

    i suspect a DRP will be implemented , but 6 monthly divs. ( instead of 3 monthly ) and the portfolio mix currently leaves me unexcited .

    i am already selectively heavy in many shares in this ( extended) portfolio , but in 2011/2012 i avoided much of the top 20 as i needed growth early in my investing career , buying VAS , VHY and QFN to blanket the large caps

    but that is me , and a NEW investor to the maket may find this attractive ( and profitable ).

    due to inherent ( perceived) weakness in the big 4 banks , TLS , BHP , RIO , and WOW the top 20 look unattractive ( but MY attitude would quickly change should our market ( XJO ) plunge through 4500 which ( IMO ) would bring many top 20 into 'good value '


    HOWEVER , had this ETF attracted me , i would be putting another 6 to 10 hours of research and deep thought into this , to utilize to best suit my needs . and possibly at least a week watching and calculating a possible enttry price .

    i have found if you put the hard work into ETFs early , they come pretty close to living up to their promises ( SLF and IEM were culled because they were not doing enough ... but not losing ground either .. just the wrong choices for me )

    i aleady hold QFN and HVST from Betashares and they suit my needs better

    ( DYOR )
     
  4. Hodor

    Hodor Well-Known Member

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    They speak about many investors large exposure to top 20 stocks and this ETF as a way to have a more balanced portfolio.

    I'll be interested to see where the yield lands, not having the big for, TLS etc may have an impact there.

    Fee seems good.
     
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  5. twisted strategies

    twisted strategies Well-Known Member

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    in comparison

    CIE ( a LIC ) which i hold

    VALUE Company Market Sector
    Morningstar Earnings Model -- 0.94 0.97
    P/E Ratio ... 25.40 17.30 18.00
    P/B Ratio ...0.98 1.48 1.05
    P/E Growth Ratio -- 1.69 1.24
    INCOME Company Market Sector
    Dividend Yield.... 6.7% 4.2% 4.2%
    Franking 50.0% -- --
    Tax Adj. Dividend Yield.... 4.5% 3.0% 3.2%
    Dividend Stability 100.0% 91.6% 90.7%
    RISK Company Market Sector
    Beta 0.79 1.01 1.19

    TOP 10 STOCK HOLDINGS WITHIN THE CIE INVESTMENT PORTFOLIO

    ASX ASX Limited 6.5%
    BEN Bendigo and Adelaide Bank Ltd 5.9%
    BOQ Bank of Queensland Limited 5.7%
    TTS Tatts Group Limited 5.1%
    TAH TABCORP Holdings Limited 4.6%
    JBH JB Hi-Fi Limited 3.6%
    DUE Duet Group 3.9%
    SKI Spark Infrastructure Group 3.5%
    PPT Perpetual Limited 2.6%
    VCX Vicinity Centres 2.6%

    The top 10 positions total 44% of the portfolio – at the date of this report the portfolio has 40 stocks.
    FY16 Final 3.5 cents per share Ex-date 13/09/16 Paid 28/09/16
    FY17 Interim Minimum of 3.0 cents per share Payable March 2017 Guidance
    FY17 Final Minimum of 3.4 cents per share Payable September 2017 Guidance

    i still 'double up ' on BEN , BOQ , TAH , and SKI but at lower value premium ( a cheaper paper profit ) them doubled up holdings in EX20 .

    the CIE portfolio is still a work in progress ( for the last year )

    EX20 doesn't do enough (of the tiny detail stuff ) for me , although to be fair , i was stock picking in a similar frame of mind ( good EPS growth potential stocks ) from very early on in my investing adventure .( 2011)

    also should the ASX have a correction ( not impossible, even this year ) EX20 might be ideal for a novice ( not that i am a fan of directing novces to ETFs , would rather the novice pick ,say 3 LICs)

    however EX20 is a very new ETF and may prove to be the right product for the time it was launched ( a sideways market , and investment cash being forced into the share market due to lack of better choices )
     
  6. JoelVermeer

    JoelVermeer Member

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    I am wondering whether EX20 is a decent surrogate for an Australian Mid-cap tracker. Is there a better option to do that out there, that I can't find?
     
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  7. Hodor

    Hodor Well-Known Member

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    MVS might be worth a look. Higher MER, likely to have a better yield as it only includes dividend payers.

    If you want active management then QVE and MIR are some LICs to look at with MER below 1%, both are at a premium currently.
     
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  8. twisted strategies

    twisted strategies Well-Known Member

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    a valid suggestion,

    i went the contrarian path and cherry-picked mid-caps when large caps were the preference ,

    so if currently lightweight on mid-caps , definitely an option .

    issue one is the ETF is new ( immature ) which may be either good or bad .

    a quick look on commsec suggests only the market makers are playing ( currently )
    EX20
    14.660 14.680 14.690 14.690 13,650 1 200,519 14.690 14.640

    ( 1 sale of 13,650 units )
    10:22:19 AM $14.690 13,650 $200,518.500

    alternates ?? another interesting question ??

    some LICs are taking that strategy but will obviously be hard-pressed to track reliably ,

    the 'high yield' ETFs did some of that by default when the top 20 were over-priced , but many top 20 are sliding into fair value range , again so maybe not the solution now .

    originally i held SLF as an attempt to do this i sold at a profit , when they weren't doing ' enough '

    VAP ( i don't hold ) might do better 3 monthly divs + DRP and a wider definition of 'property ' than many (S&P/ASX 300 A-REIT Index)

    COSTS
    Management costs


    0.23% p.a. ( not over the top )







    Market Depth