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Greece, pull your gut in.

Discussion in 'General Investing Discussion' started by Johny_come_lately, 8th May, 2010.

  1. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    Hi,

    I don't often vent my frustration on the net, but today I will. The All Ords is down 500 in about a week, with probably more falls.

    I've spent some time researching greece topics. The big issues are a corrupt inefficient balloon govt., easy living, low pension age, citizens living beyond their means, systemic corruption and bribery, nepotism and lots of debt.

    For the greek people not to accept the bailout is hurting the world. And there is only 11 million of them.

    nuff said




    Johny.
     
  2. AsxBroker

    AsxBroker Well-Known Member

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    Hi Johny,

    Think about the great buying opportunities for the long term quality stocks :)

    Yes, the glass is half full not half empty :)

    Cheers,

    Dan
     
  3. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    Johny mate

    You aren't seeing the full picture
    Greek governments did borrow too much but they didn't cause the problem.
    I'll post some links. Do some more reading and then we talk, I've researched the subject as well because I want to look at opportunities.

    Greece has come under attack from financial markets and has been ?pushed down the stairs?, Swiss economist Paul Dembinski tells swissinfo.ch. - swissinfo

    http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2010/05/europes-web-of-debt/


    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a47745ec-5959-11df-99ba-00144feab49a.html
     
  4. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    I've posted elsewhere the following"
     
  5. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    Hi Billv,

    I'll admit everything I read came from mainstream journo's. Your threads indicate that Greece is being manipulated for financial gain. Do you think it should be allowed to default?



    Johny.
     
  6. dudek

    dudek Well-Known Member

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    I also see this as a buying opportunity. I don’t believe 11milion people can be blamed for affecting world economy. There is other element to the stock market - fear. Question no one can answer is how dip this roller coaster ride will be. People made some good gains in less that 12 months and because last crash happened not long ago most of the people still feel it and will rather pool their money with what ever gains and wait. (myself including)
    It does not take much to spark massive sale of stocks. This one can also be quite dip ride.
     
  7. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    My personal opinion is yes, because it will give them the opportunity to start fresh. Ofcourse their new currency will fall like a stone but goods and services will become cheap so their economy will boom.
    The people will lose their good standard of living though.
    Imported goods will become very expensive.

    However, a defaul will be a huge embarrassment for the EU and there is the risk that other countries will follow them and they could end up with Eurozone disintegration.
    A default also means that banking institutions superannuation funds etc will lose money so it's French and German banks and pensions at stake.

    There is a better option.
    Let the ECB give them low interest loans and put in place a loan repayment plan. The EU are now lending them money at 5% and make a profit (they borrow at 3 &4 % except for poor Portugal) ) and this only makes the Greek debt situation worse
     
  8. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    Dan
    I was going to add some resourse stocks to my portfolio but now with the resources tax I don't know what's good value.
    Also, do you think this correction has more to go?
     
  9. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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  10. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    Weren't those credit rating agencies the ones that backed all that mortgage debt in the US?




    Johny.
     
  11. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    Yes, as far as I know they are the same ones.

    The same players are still playing the system
    Why were they rating junk loans as AAA+ and are now rating guaranteed government bonds as junk?

    This proves that ratings agencies are either incompetent or not independent.
    IMO they are all in it for the money.
    Financial markets were meant to be regulated a couple of years ago but for whatever reason they haven't been touched.
     
  12. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    So who creates fair laws for the future?




    Johny
     
  13. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    And who regulates the regulators?





    Johny.
     
  14. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    None is.
    Regulation is what we need and it would have to start from the US but trying to get them to regulate financial markets could be a challenge.
    Perhaps Obama will attempt to reform this sector one day
     
  15. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    I have a Canadian friend who wants me to commit to more US and Foreign companies. I think I'll stay heavy Oz at the moment. We seem to be taking the least flak here!





    Johny.
     
  16. Tropo

    Tropo Well-Known Member

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    Money...(IMHO). ;)
     
  17. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    Me too. I'm not going near O/S shares atm but unfortunately they're dragging us down too. We seem to be going up and down and sideways a lot.
     
  18. Johny_come_lately

    Johny_come_lately Well-Known Member

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    The Question is: How can we best benefit from the current situation?





    Johny.
     
  19. Chris C

    Chris C Well-Known Member

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    LOL - the world isn't scared of Greece defaulting - the world is scared of being reminded about how indebted the rest of the western world is. Greece defaulting makes it more likely that bond holders will pull the plug on the rest of the bludgers that are on life support as well.

    The only reasons the world is scared of the possibility of "contagion" is because Greece are not the only country in the world that has a very sick economy with a big, ineffective, corrupt government coupled with a welfare dependant and lazy public.

    So at the end of the day - it's not Greece's fault - they are just the first cab off the rank.

    :D

    In a real sense - yep! In a nominal sense... who knows. My bet is down significantly, then up even more significantly as a result of monetary stimulus (ie ZIRP and/or QE)...
     
  20. Billv

    Billv Getting there

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    It looks like the Eurozone countries have put enough protection in place to fight the speculators.

    So we'll be back to the good old
    up and down and sideways movements again
    and probably sooner rather than later.

    World Races to Avert Crisis in Europe - WSJ.com