Managed Funds Navra Unit Price

Discussion in 'Shares & Funds' started by ActiveTrade, 13th Jun, 2008.

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  1. Alan__

    Alan__ Well-Known Member

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    Depending on the eventual outcome of some new LOC setups........I'll be right behind you Carl....
     
    Alan__, 11th Jul, 2008
    #101
  2. lorrimer

    lorrimer Well-Known Member

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    Carl,
    I'm thinking along the same lines as you.I used my LOC to purchase some more units this week and will continue with another 4/5 similar sized purchases over the coming weeks and months.
    Hoping to lower my cost base and increase future income at the same time.
    Will be reinvesting distributions this time to hopefully keep the LVR more healthy and draw down on the margin loan if the LVR permits.
    As it is going to create more of a tax burden, I may need to start looking for a bargain or two in the real estate market to negatively gear and offset the extra tax.
     
    lorrimer, 12th Jul, 2008
    #102
  3. ActiveTrade

    ActiveTrade Well-Known Member

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    :eek::eek::eek:
     
    ActiveTrade, 14th Jul, 2008
    #103
  4. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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    Now around 70.5%
     
    Redwing, 21st Oct, 2008
    #104
  5. voigtstr

    voigtstr Well-Known Member

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    what accounts for the small movement in the navra retail fund on the 16th, 17th and 20th. I thought the fund was moved to cash on or about the 16th. Is the .0001 drop in price on the 17th caused by management fees, and the .0006 climb on the 20th caused by interest? Not being petty, just curious!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 21st Oct, 2008
    voigtstr, 21st Oct, 2008
    #105
  6. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    Yes, there are fees (including administration costs) and there is income coming in ... even a fund which only ever invests in cash (eg CFS Cash) has daily unit price movements ... quite normal.
     
    Simon Hampel, 21st Oct, 2008
    #106
  7. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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    Makes sense Sim,

    I talked to Suncorp today re the Margin Call and the amount to be delivered had increased since yesterday so the Funds value/Unit Price must've dipped again even though in cash
     
    Redwing, 22nd Oct, 2008
    #107
  8. Chris.R_WA

    Chris.R_WA Well-Known Member

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    Hey Redwing!

    I just paid a margin call to Suncorp as well !! How about that...


    What interest rate are you paying now, I notice mine has dropped a bit (not a lot :rolleyes:) to 9.75%?

    Cheers, Chris
     
    Chris.R_WA, 22nd Oct, 2008
    #108
  9. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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    9.45% I'd locked in some time ago, I'm guessing with the way things are going with rates you'll benefit more than I shortly :D

    When checking latest rates on the properties to update a spreadsheet, WBC told me there was another .2% reduction coming our way at the end of the Month
     
    Redwing, 25th Oct, 2008
    #109
  10. TPI

    TPI Well-Known Member

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    Hi there,

    Silly question coming...what does that mean?

    Eg. if you had bought $10000 of Navra units at $1 per unit at inception, does that mean your initial capital investment is now worth $8415??

    (Assuming, no further additional investments or withdrawals, and all income distributions are being used for other purposes.)

    Thanks for the clarification, I'm not too familiar with this...
     
    TPI, 25th Oct, 2008
    #110
  11. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    Actually JIT - I'm sure you are more than familiar with this and you are just trolling :p

    ... but I will humour you and explain:

    Yes, you are completely correct in that your investment of $1 at inception would now be worth somewhat less if you had taken all distributions as cash rather than reinvesting them.

    Here are some other examples of managed funds which have seen capital fall of late:

    Unit price ($) APIR Fund name

    0.230500 BTA0127AU BT Technology Fund
    0.245400 FSF0894AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Property Securities Opportunities
    0.276300 EQI0003AU Challenger Diversified Income Fund
    0.363300 FSF0727AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice Global Property Securities
    0.428000 RFA0030AU BT Core Hedged Global Share Fund
    0.434450 BTA0131AU BT Japanese Share Fund
    0.444800 FSF0144AU Colonial First State Global Technology & Communications Fund
    0.445600 FSF0222AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice Property Securities
    0.470250 FSF0662AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Index Property Securities
    0.471000 EQI0004AU Challenger Australian Share Income Fund
    0.470350 WFS0387AU BT Global Property
    0.485800 FSF0899AU Colonial First State - Challenger Property Securities
    0.489450 FSF0809AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice Global Share - Hedged
    0.490650 WFS0329AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac Australian Property Securities Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.498250 WFS0096AU BT UBS Australian Share
    0.540650 FSF0665AU Colonial First State - Pengana Property Securities
    0.558650 FSF0249AU Colonial First State - RREEF Property Securities
    0.566200 WAR0005AU Challenger Property Securities Fund
    0.570450 FSF0088AU Colonial First State Developing Companies
    0.575000 PER0240AU Perpetual Property Securities Fund
    0.575650 FSF0250AU Colonial First State - BT Property Investment
    0.577800 FSF0813AU Colonial First State - PM Capital Absolute Performance
    0.578650 FSF0089AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Future Leaders
    0.582800 WFS0326AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac All Australian Growth Share Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.589400 FSF0247AU Colonial First State - AXA Global Equity - Growth
    0.595050 FSF0874AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice Global Infrastructure Securities
    0.595250 FSF0666AU Colonial First State Colliers Global Property Securities
    0.597600 FSF0810AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Index Global Share - Hedged
    0.605400 FSF0226AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice High Growth
    0.612750 WFS0330AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac Sustainability Fund Australian Shares - Nil Entry Fee
    0.620050 FSF0012AU Colonial First State Property Securities Fund
    0.628750 WFS0335AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac Dynamic Growth Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.630650 FSF0730AU Colonial First State - Ausbil Australian Emerging Leaders
    0.632300 FSF0232AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Imputation
    0.646700 FSF0808AU Colonial First State - Challenger Select Australian Share
    0.648750 WFS0332AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac International Share Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.662150 FSF0248AU Colonial First State - Credit Suisse International Share
    0.663850 FSF0782AU Colonial First State - Acadian Australian Equity
    0.668850 FSF0221AU Colonial First State - FirstChoice Global Share
    0.670000 FSF0875AU Colonial First State - Acadian Global Equity Long Short
    0.678000 WFS0290AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac Sustainability Fund - International Shares
    0.690900 FSF0242AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) Global Share
    0.691750 WFS0327AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac All Australian Tax Effective Share Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.692600 FSF0245AU Colonial First State - BT Core Global Share
    0.694500 FSF0263AU Colonial First State (FirstChoice) High Growth
    0.698650 WFS0102AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac All Australian Growth Share Fund
    0.700900 WFS0334AU BT Investor Choice - Westpac Balanced Growth Fund - Nil Entry Fee
    0.701350 FSF0871AU Colonial First State - Merrill Lynch Monthly Income
    0.712500 PER0275AU Perpetual Property Income Fund

    ... in fact I count 60 retail funds (from my list of 200 or so) which currently see their unit price below that of Navra's and nearly 170 which have a unit price of below 1.00

    Actually - it may have been easier to list those managed funds which still DO have a unit price above $1.000 ... I only see about 75 in my list :eek:

    How many shares on the ASX are currently trading below their list price I wonder ?
     
    Simon Hampel, 25th Oct, 2008
    #111
  12. TPI

    TPI Well-Known Member

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    Aha, thanks Sim,

    So if I had $10000 capital initially giving me an 8% pa distribution, or $800 pa...

    Now, with $8415 capital left, to get the same $800 pa absolute dollar value distribution, I would need a 9.5% pa distribution to stay level?

    ie. I now have 16% less capital and need 19% more distribution to break even?

    Would that be correct?

    Ta.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 25th Oct, 2008
    TPI, 25th Oct, 2008
    #112
  13. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    JIT - I'm not sure what you are trying to show or prove with your numbers.

    The market is down 43.3% from its Nov 1st highs.

    Pretty much every Australian fund out there is down at least this much.

    So what is your point ?
     
    Simon Hampel, 25th Oct, 2008
    #113
  14. Rick__

    Rick__ Well-Known Member

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    I know what your getting at JIT so I'll give you my figures on what the fund has done for me.

    Firstly it's an income fund. That's my only reason for investing in it.

    My investment started in 2005 so it's been almost exactly 3 years.

    Total return -20.6% ie. total current value + total distributions - interest
    Total distributions on original investment +41.5%
    Average monthly cashflow available to support other investments for the 3 year period to date +.4% per month. :)

    Performance of my portfolio of directly owned shares in 33 companies over this period is currently -52% including dividends. Overweight resource stocks :(

    So it helps if you look at the big picture!

    I'm sure we're all learning lots during this turmoil and I know I will be making adjustments to my future thinking and strategies.

    I don't believe all the doom and gloom clap trap and to me the very amount of it that we are now seeing and reading is a sign that we're in for better things sooner rather then later. :)
     
    Rick__, 26th Oct, 2008
    #114
  15. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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    I was speaking to an older workmate who has semi-retired, many of his SMSF share based investments (Man Funds, LPT's, Direct Blue Chip and a few speccie shares..mainly biased towards income, not growth) have taken a huge hit, with some down to 90% potential loss

    A 90% drop means he's looking for 900% growth to get back to even :confused:
     
    Redwing, 4th Nov, 2008
    #115
  16. Handyandy

    Handyandy Well-Known Member

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    Hi Rick

    You have obviously done the figures I still need to do:eek:

    Can I just ask what interest rate and LVR you were operating with as this obviously has a bearing on the net returns over the 3 years.

    Cheers

    PS Also did you reinvest or take the distributions?
     
    Handyandy, 4th Nov, 2008
    #116
  17. Rick__

    Rick__ Well-Known Member

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    G'day handyandy

    Average interest rates worked out at:

    YR 1 5.68% not a full year
    YR 2 7.82%
    YR 3 8.42%
    YR 4 3.21% not a full year

    These are for combined LOC loan for 50% and Margin Loan for 50%.

    All distributions taken as cash.

    Hope this helps.

    Huge lessons learn't through all this and I am inclined to adopt an more active trading strategy with share and fund investments when the dust settles.
    Buy and Hold has proven to be a failed strategy for this market. Although it worked very well in the 2001 - 2007 era. :)
     
    Rick__, 4th Nov, 2008
    #117
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