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Should Navrainvest shareholders disclose their positions?

Discussion in 'Help & Feedback' started by Glebe, 19th Oct, 2007.


Should Navrainvest shareholders disclose the fact that they're shareholders?

Poll closed 26th Oct, 2007.
  1. Yes

    10 vote(s)
  2. No

    7 vote(s)
  3. Don't Care

    21 vote(s)
  1. Glebe

    Glebe Well-Known Member

    15th Aug, 2005
    Sydney, NSW
    Hey there,

    Invested's population base always have conversations around Navrainvest's managed fund products.

    Do you believe Navrainvest's shareholders, who post their opinion's on Navrainvest's products and product performance, should disclose the fact that they're Navrainvest shareholders, not unlike a journalist disclosing their position in a topic they're writing about?

    Are you concerned about, at least, the possible perception of conflict of interest?
  2. TryHard

    TryHard Well-Known Member

    17th Aug, 2005
    As a shareholder, I voted 'don't care' ... in my opinion any debate on NI generally gets a bit over-enthusiastic from the side of both detractors and supporters.

    Declaring an interest one way or the other won't make the actual debate any more balanced, but if someone wants to point out they either are or aren't a shareholder to define their comments I guess that's up to them ?

    Of the many threads on the subject, I've found some of the comments from both the "for" and "against" extremely valuable. I view comments on here along with any other measures I take into account, within my limited ability/knowledge (suitability to our personal strategy and position, history, exposure, risk profile, SANF, value vs.other opportunities etc.) and give them the credit they deserve in deciding in NI is for us or not. Knowing someone who makes a comment is a shareholder wouldn't vastly impact the overall assessment in my blinkered little world :)
  3. Alan

    Alan Well-Known Member

    15th Aug, 2005
    Lean towards 'Don't care' too BUT.......

    While I'm a Navrainvest Shareholder I don't intend to say that everytime I discuss anything relating to the topic. This is a general Investment Forum, not a Court of Law.

    Having said that, if you're likely to be regularly involved in discussion on this topic, it's probably fair enough to declare your position at some time though. In fairness, I think most do this anyway. Nigel, Carl, Sim, myself etc. have all mentioned a Shareholder position on a number of occasions. People can judge for themselves over a period of time whether they think people's comments are well balanced or not.

    As an aside, I don't necessarily believe being a Shareholder, or a Unitholder for that matter, necessarily gives an unrealistic bias in discussion. Some of the best analytical and dare I say, critical discussion I've heard has been made from Unitholders/Shareholders.
  4. Paul C

    Paul C Member

    6th Sep, 2006
    Hi, I'm not a shareholder and I vote NO. I think its irrelevant . No one is expecting to declare an interest in any other fund or, stock , or preperty in general.

    If this day and age we do not realise what this forum is for , or what "advice" means, we might as well give the game away.

    ...p.s... this is my opinion only and not professional advice...;):)

  5. Simon

    Simon Well-Known Member

    17th Sep, 2005
    I don't think ramping has been a problem here and I doubt it will.

    I voted don't care as it doesn't concern me at my level of knowledge. But I would be concerned if I started to see shareholder aggressively promoting the fund in any forum without a declaration.
  6. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Co-founder Staff Member

    9th Jun, 2005
    Sydney, Australia
    Nobody would expect people to declare an interest in Platinum Asset Management or in Commonwealth Bank (owner of Colonial First State), or in Westpac (owner of BT Financial Group) etc etc.

    ... and in reality, if you consider that with something like 20 million shares on offer, someone who holds 20,000 shares (a $50K investment at the last offering), holds a 0.1% holding in the company. If they were able to influence an additional $1m of investment into the funds, @ 1.5%pa management fee (an extra $15K of gross income to the company), that would mean a potential maximum $15 per year income from dividends (in reality a lot less). That's not a lot.

    ... but either way, I think many of the active posters here who are also shareholders have indeed disclosed their holdings as a matter of courtesy.
  7. TryHard

    TryHard Well-Known Member

    17th Aug, 2005
    Its a positive for InvestEd an issue like this can be raised and discussed sensibly.

    On 'another' forum, the Navra criticism, often ill-informed and lacking any balance whatsoever, led me to wonder what 'interests' some of the critics should have declared (the only logical reason appeared to be 'tall poppy' bashing, but it was so aggressive you'd assume something else was at stake).

    Fair enough to request declaration of interests from people supporting a concept, but its not as easy to identify the motivations of people vehemently opposed to something. That vehement opposition could have as much unfortunate impact on the investing activity of others, as any over-promotion.

    Also on 'another' forum, very vocal supporters of property in the Ipswich area often failed to disclose they were already heavily invested there (when a lot of others reckoned there were much better places to buy at the time).

    Personal bias will probably creep into any public discussion - as Sim says the difference on this forum is most people don't post as if they have something to hide :cool:

    While people are engaging in a discussion or a debate that is not professional advice, I think we need to appreciate everyone has all sorts of interests shaping their opinions, and some of those interests might even be subconscious :) Personally I have nothing to hide, and I'll try to remember to declare why I have an opinion, but that could make for long posts (like this one :p)
  8. jenpalex

    jenpalex Active Member

    16th Aug, 2005
    Well I am a Navrainvest investor, both in the Funds and the management company, but not an uncritical one, as you will see from some of my other posts. Navrainvest funds will suit some people, times and purposes and not others. If you are making your share investments relying on the judgement and integrity of others rather than assessing the strength of the arguments they make you will lose both money and friends.

    If I make money on an investment I am lucky. If I lose money or don't make as much as I expected, I made a mistake which I must identify and not repeat. In other words be humble and take responsibility for your own decisions
  9. Nigel Ward

    Nigel Ward Team InvestEd

    10th Jun, 2005

    I couldn't have said it better! ...except to say to a large degree you make your own luck.

  10. MichaelWhyte

    MichaelWhyte Well-Known Member

    5th Oct, 2005
    Sydney, NSW
    In my opinion, Yes they should, but only when posting opinion on them or their products.

    For the record, I am not a Navra share holder so my opinions are entirely that, my opinions.

    I must admit to a degree of affinity with Navra however, which has the potential to bias my comments with regards to the Navra group or their products. I like the company, Steve himself and his extended team.

    Having said that, I only ever post my opinion when speculating or making analytical comments, and as stated already, all opinions need to be treated with a degree of scepticism. Wherever possible I try to limit my observations about their products to factual analysis only, but at times comment on my perception of their performance. When doing so I attempt to caveat the observation as opinon only.

  11. Denis

    Denis Well-Known Member

    16th Aug, 2005
    I am a Navrainvest investor, both in the Funds and the management company.
    Most members would be aware of this.
    I have often criticised NI and Steve Navra only to keep him to the high standards that he has always espoused.He needs to be challenged when l feel he gets arrogant and will not accept fair criticism, although on a number of occasions what occurs in the forum is hardly fair.
    Having said that, one reason l will stick with Steve is that he is honest, ethical and has integrity.On a number of occasions, he has put shareholders interests ahead of his own and this is to be commended.Of course he is going to make a lot of money, but he also gets huge satisfaction from generating wealth for all his clients and having the appreciation and respect that comes with it.